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| Any plans to rework aggro? https://na.nasomi.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=258 |
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| Author: | Fyfe [ Mon May 02, 2016 10:17 am ] |
| Post subject: | Any plans to rework aggro? |
Something about the aggro feels really weird and I'm seeing a lot of nin subjob probably for the blink to evade damage when enmity goes whack. Is there any future plans to rework aggro so other jobs can take something other than nin? or rather has that already been fixed is it still a thing? |
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| Author: | Deadwing [ Mon May 02, 2016 10:29 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Any plans to rework aggro? |
If you're talking about the enmity system: it's working true to retail as far as we know. People blink tank with ninja and sub nin a lot in exp groups, that's just how this game is played. |
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| Author: | Insight [ Mon May 02, 2016 8:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Any plans to rework aggro? |
I recall talk of enmity generated from cure is more than it should be, haven't really noticed myself, as I never played a job where I would notice it. So I can't provide any details or specifics where that is concerned. As for everything else, it's more or less where it should be, BRD spells, particularly the offensive ones, feel like they're generating more than they should but not something I cared enough to look into. As for Ninja sub job, it was always common practice to have heavy DD's sub it in retail for EXP pties, and certain other instances. That being said, where EXP pties are concerned, it was not the optimal choice (bar certain era's, and certain jobs) besides for pties in the lower levels. Subbing Ninja would be used to circumvent a bad party composition, and/or alleviate strain on incompetent main healers. Mind you, here on Nasomi, it seems like the use of sub Ninja is necessitated even further. Not because of how enmity is currently functioning, but because of enemies "tank buster" moves seem more powerful here than they ever were on retail. Those being breath attacks, and certain other ones, such as "Screwdriver", "Power Attack", and "Stomping" to name a few. My guess would be that they're always scoring a critical hit on these attacks, while it only had a chance on retail. Breaths on the other hand, are very clearly whacked out damage-wise. |
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| Author: | rori [ Tue May 03, 2016 5:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Any plans to rework aggro? |
Enmity drops off way faster here than on retail, at least at the XP group level. Not sure how it is on HNMs. |
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| Author: | Deadwing [ Fri May 06, 2016 6:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Any plans to rework aggro? |
rori wrote: Enmity drops off way faster here than on retail, at least at the XP group level. Not sure how it is on HNMs. This just isn't factual. It's 60VE/sec same as retail. I've looked at the console prints with my own eyes. |
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| Author: | asuranknight [ Sat May 07, 2016 6:25 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Any plans to rework aggro? |
Deadwing wrote: rori wrote: Enmity drops off way faster here than on retail, at least at the XP group level. Not sure how it is on HNMs. This just isn't factual. It's 60VE/sec same as retail. I've looked at the console prints with my own eyes. Volatile enmity is not the only factor though. Is it possible that we take more damage here and thus lose cumulative enmity at a quicker rate? I have considered that perhaps we might be using the modern (as in the last several years version) ffxi defense formula here which would be a net increase in damage taken. Do you know if we are using this formula or the one that was used in the 75 era of xi? Other than that mob stats in general might be resulting in higher damage taken and thus a faster drop off of total enmity. |
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| Author: | Deadwing [ Sat May 07, 2016 5:58 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Any plans to rework aggro? |
asuranknight wrote: Volatile enmity is not the only factor though. Is it possible that we take more damage here and thus lose cumulative enmity at a quicker rate? I have considered that perhaps we might be using the modern (as in the last several years version) ffxi defense formula here which would be a net increase in damage taken. Do you know if we are using this formula or the one that was used in the 75 era of xi? Other than that mob stats in general might be resulting in higher damage taken and thus a faster drop off of total enmity. Outside of a few mob weaponskills, damage taken at the EXP level seems about right to me. Even if it was off, it would be more likely that the extra cures would throw off enmity than loss of CE. CE just isn't a very big enmity factor in quick exp fights. We are using the modern defense formula. This means defense is a more relevant stat than it was. As a result, the benefits of having a PL go up (with protect III) and penalties for wearing low defense/under-leveled gear are higher. |
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| Author: | asuranknight [ Wed May 11, 2016 12:49 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Any plans to rework aggro? |
See, the damage feels notably higher in general for me and the modern defense formula is most certainly to blame. While it does make defense more important, that forumula was built for a level 99 or so ffxi (with minimal consideration for anything below that level not unlike the changes to magic) and it makes a bunch of weird instances at lower levels and probably even at 75 cap. While it certainly doesn't break the game its likely that anything outside of paladin is taking more damage because of it and at certain levels and gear setups even paladin might be taking more than it would have back in 75 cap xi. I mean, when they patched that change in even everything at level 99 took more damage so they specifically made sure to add a note that players shouldn't worry because they would be adding in armor with greater defense for all jobs in the future (that is to say that by default the change resulted in greater damage taken). It is also worth noting that many jobs do not wear on-level or high defense gear to be optimal (good example might be a dd wearing leaping boots for a long time). While it can be argued that these jobs wont be taking hits and a tank should be instead, there are cases where they are going to anyway such as certain battlefields/missions and in the case of aoe attacks (again this is a result of the system being based on 99 xi where item levels meant everyone was wearing high def gear). Just the same, I don't exactly expect it to change but its worth considering when thinking about the enmity balance (even if it may or may not be the most significant factor). |
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| Author: | Deadwing [ Wed May 11, 2016 4:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Any plans to rework aggro? |
I mean I'd like to see it the old way too. It's handled at the deepest levels of the server though. Good luck finding the era formula, writing the C++, and actually getting it implemented. |
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| Author: | asuranknight [ Wed May 11, 2016 11:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Any plans to rework aggro? |
As said, I don't exactly expect it to change and i'm not sure what if anything could be done about it at this time but I think it plays a role in appearance of strange hate management. |
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