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PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 2:48 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2018 10:49 am
Posts: 80
i use raja, brutal, hachiman kote, and full merits. works for me


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 3:03 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2018 10:49 am
Posts: 80
my sam aint all that great on this server but ive just been using ace's helm, swift belt, byakko's haidate, fuma sune-ate (and the rare occasion im /drg wyvern earring)

i dont remember the math cause im an idiot but using hachiman kote instead of sune ate lets you ws with just raja brutal and tp merits and still six hit so you can ws with better boots or different gloves


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 3:16 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2018 10:49 am
Posts: 80
i use rutter sabatons for my ws boots

as far as i can tell on this server ws damage seems all kinds of jacked up so it probably doesnt matter very much, my soboro does the same amount of ws damage as shinsoku half the time but maybe im just not used to not having a hagun


Last edited by Lempo on Tue Jul 23, 2019 3:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 6:41 am 
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Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2018 1:10 pm
Posts: 556
Assuming you have 5/5 STP merits, to 6-hit a 450 Delay GK you will have to either eat Carbonara (or some other STP food) or drop your haste from hands or feet. Since most of my playtime on SAM is end game content, I didn't want to eat Carbonara. Here are the two paths I saw (plus a fringe alternate case):

Path 1: TP in Rajas, Brutal and Hachi Feet- you will have 835 TP after 5 hits- will need 165 TP from ws. WS in Rajas Brutal and Hachi Feet OR Rajas Brutal and Enkidu Subligar.
Upsides: Dusk Gloves for TP have +5 ATK which is better than the +3 AGI on Fuma Sune-Ate. Also +20 HP on Dusk vs +12 on Sune-Ate
Downsides: Requires extra STP in ws set in the form of Hachi Feet or Enkidu Subligar. Both are small downgrades to what you would be using if you didn't need to make up STP.

Path 2: TP in Rajas, Brutal and Hachi Hands- you will have 855 tp after 5 hits. You will still ws in Rajas and Brutal but you won't even need that STP to make your 6 hit.
Upsides: You will gain 2-4 ish STR, as well as some ATK etc. in your ws build by using more optimal pieces since you won't need any STP.
Downsides: Opposite of the Upside listed above- Using the lesser of the two TP piece options.

Path 3 (Fringe Alternate): TP in Rajas, Brutal, Hachi Feet and Attila's Earring- you will have 845 tp after 5 hits- will need 155 tp from WS which, similar to Path 2 above, can be achieved with no STP in WS set (tho you will still want to wear Rajas and Brutal regardless). DISCLAIMER: This choice is AWFUL is you opt for Bush. Earring from DM, however, if you have a diff. earring and this downgrade is a Merman's to Attila to improve WS set it's not that bad. It largely depends on what gear you have access too. I'm just trying to tell you how to get there. This is the least optimal choice of the three but may work for you depending on gear.

As far as which Hachi Piece is a better TP piece, the answer is neither really. You want them for the STP. Neither bonus effect will be active while you TP except when you hold TP over 1000 using the Hachi Hands. Hachi Hands also have 2 more STR than the feet so I guess they are a slight winner here though they are both a bummer when you consider losing 3 haste. But IMO a 6-hit is that much better than a 7-hit that it's almost always worth it though there are a few exceptions I suppose.

There aren't a ton of STP choices on the server so unless I am missing something, these are your two best options. I've spent a lot of time fucking with hit builds to the point where I actually wrote a spreadsheet to do all the calculations for me as I toggled pieces in and out trying to deal with Amano's retarded delay. Feel free to /tell me in game or PM me if you have any other questions specific to my response.

Edit: From what I am told, the STP on Myochin Haidate +1 (upgraded SAM AF legs) doesn't work. If that is ever fixed we could finagle some other builds here as well.

Edit 2: This is all based on the idea that you have NQ Dusk Gloves. If you have Dusk Gloves +1 then this is all a moot point. But if you have Dusk Gloves +1 then you should be asking about a 437 delay GK :lol:

Edit 3: Math changes ever so slightly if you have HQ Hachi pieces. If you have HQ feet you can TP in them and get same result as Path 3 without having the earring swap. HQ hands are overkill for 450 delay GK as the NQ hands will give you more than enough STP.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 2:17 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2018 1:10 pm
Posts: 556
GrendelsPRGuy wrote:
Dodi wrote:
Assuming you have 5/5 STP merits, to 6-hit a 450 Delay GK you will have to either eat Carbonara (or some other STP food) or drop your haste from hands or feet. Since most of my playtime on SAM is end game content, I didn't want to eat Carbonara. Here are the two paths I saw (plus a fringe alternate case):

Path 1: TP in Rajas, Brutal and Hachi Feet- you will have 835 TP after 5 hits- will need 165 TP from ws. WS in Rajas Brutal and Hachi Feet OR Rajas Brutal and Enkidu Subligar.
Upsides: Dusk Gloves for TP have +5 ATK which is better than the +3 AGI on Fuma Sune-Ate. Also +20 HP on Dusk vs +12 on Sune-Ate
Downsides: Requires extra STP in ws set in the form of Hachi Feet or Enkidu Subligar. Both are small downgrades to what you would be using if you didn't need to make up STP.

Path 2: TP in Rajas, Brutal and Hachi Hands- you will have 855 tp after 5 hits. You will still ws in Rajas and Brutal but you won't even need that STP to make your 6 hit.
Upsides: You will gain 2-4 ish STR, as well as some ATK etc. in your ws build by using more optimal pieces since you won't need any STP.
Downsides: Opposite of the Upside listed above- Using the lesser of the two TP piece options.

Path 3 (Fringe Alternate): TP in Rajas, Brutal, Hachi Feet and Attila's Earring- you will have 845 tp after 5 hits- will need 155 tp from WS which, similar to Path 2 above, can be achieved with no STP in WS set (tho you will still want to wear Rajas and Brutal regardless). DISCLAIMER: This choice is AWFUL is you opt for Bush. Earring from DM, however, if you have a diff. earring and this downgrade is a Merman's to Attila to improve WS set it's not that bad. It largely depends on what gear you have access too. I'm just trying to tell you how to get there. This is the least optimal choice of the three but may work for you depending on gear.

As far as which Hachi Piece is a better TP piece, the answer is neither really. You want them for the STP. Neither bonus effect will be active while you TP except when you hold TP over 1000 using the Hachi Hands. Hachi Hands also have 2 more STR than the feet so I guess they are a slight winner here though they are both a bummer when you consider losing 3 haste. But IMO a 6-hit is that much better than a 7-hit that it's almost always worth it though there are a few exceptions I suppose.

There aren't a ton of STP choices on the server so unless I am missing something, these are your two best options. I've spent a lot of time fucking with hit builds to the point where I actually wrote a spreadsheet to do all the calculations for me as I toggled pieces in and out trying to deal with Amano's retarded delay. Feel free to /tell me in game or PM me if you have any other questions specific to my response.

Edit: From what I am told, the STP on Myochin Haidate +1 (upgraded SAM AF legs) doesn't work. If that is ever fixed we could finagle some other builds here as well.

Edit 2: This is all based on the idea that you have NQ Dusk Gloves. If you have Dusk Gloves +1 then this is all a moot point. But if you have Dusk Gloves +1 then you should be asking about a 437 delay GK :lol:

Edit 3: Math changes ever so slightly if you have HQ Hachi pieces. If you have HQ feet you can TP in them and get same result as Path 3 without having the earring swap. HQ hands are overkill for 450 delay GK as the NQ hands will give you more than enough STP.



Thanks for the detailed response man, confirmed most of my own math and ideas which is kind of a bummer. I was hoping there was a better option than full timing Hachi Boots but I guess I'm out of luck.

Really a shame we'll never get Rose Grip that would be the ideal piece to use in my mind to keep a 6-hit build without sacrificing important haste.


Personally I am hoping he introduces Salvage at some point which means we can get these lovelies!


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 09, 2019 4:47 pm 
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Joined: Mon Apr 11, 2016 12:53 am
Posts: 78
Dodi wrote:
Assuming you have 5/5 STP merits, to 6-hit a 450 Delay GK you will have to either eat Carbonara (or some other STP food) or drop your haste from hands or feet. Since most of my playtime on SAM is end game content, I didn't want to eat Carbonara. Here are the two paths I saw (plus a fringe alternate case):

Path 1: TP in Rajas, Brutal and Hachi Feet- you will have 835 TP after 5 hits- will need 165 TP from ws. WS in Rajas Brutal and Hachi Feet OR Rajas Brutal and Enkidu Subligar.
Upsides: Dusk Gloves for TP have +5 ATK which is better than the +3 AGI on Fuma Sune-Ate. Also +20 HP on Dusk vs +12 on Sune-Ate
Downsides: Requires extra STP in ws set in the form of Hachi Feet or Enkidu Subligar. Both are small downgrades to what you would be using if you didn't need to make up STP.

Path 2: TP in Rajas, Brutal and Hachi Hands- you will have 855 tp after 5 hits. You will still ws in Rajas and Brutal but you won't even need that STP to make your 6 hit.
Upsides: You will gain 2-4 ish STR, as well as some ATK etc. in your ws build by using more optimal pieces since you won't need any STP.
Downsides: Opposite of the Upside listed above- Using the lesser of the two TP piece options.

Path 3 (Fringe Alternate): TP in Rajas, Brutal, Hachi Feet and Attila's Earring- you will have 845 tp after 5 hits- will need 155 tp from WS which, similar to Path 2 above, can be achieved with no STP in WS set (tho you will still want to wear Rajas and Brutal regardless). DISCLAIMER: This choice is AWFUL is you opt for Bush. Earring from DM, however, if you have a diff. earring and this downgrade is a Merman's to Attila to improve WS set it's not that bad. It largely depends on what gear you have access too. I'm just trying to tell you how to get there. This is the least optimal choice of the three but may work for you depending on gear.

As far as which Hachi Piece is a better TP piece, the answer is neither really. You want them for the STP. Neither bonus effect will be active while you TP except when you hold TP over 1000 using the Hachi Hands. Hachi Hands also have 2 more STR than the feet so I guess they are a slight winner here though they are both a bummer when you consider losing 3 haste. But IMO a 6-hit is that much better than a 7-hit that it's almost always worth it though there are a few exceptions I suppose.

There aren't a ton of STP choices on the server so unless I am missing something, these are your two best options. I've spent a lot of time fucking with hit builds to the point where I actually wrote a spreadsheet to do all the calculations for me as I toggled pieces in and out trying to deal with Amano's retarded delay. Feel free to /tell me in game or PM me if you have any other questions specific to my response.

Edit: From what I am told, the STP on Myochin Haidate +1 (upgraded SAM AF legs) doesn't work. If that is ever fixed we could finagle some other builds here as well.

Edit 2: This is all based on the idea that you have NQ Dusk Gloves. If you have Dusk Gloves +1 then this is all a moot point. But if you have Dusk Gloves +1 then you should be asking about a 437 delay GK :lol:

Edit 3: Math changes ever so slightly if you have HQ Hachi pieces. If you have HQ feet you can TP in them and get same result as Path 3 without having the earring swap. HQ hands are overkill for 450 delay GK as the NQ hands will give you more than enough STP.


I too struggle with setups with the damn amano. It's a blessing and curse. I seriously consider switching to the JSE 50 body to keep 6 hit and not sacrifice haste. I have the +1 dusk sitting collecting dust on sam.

I'll probably try it out if hachi body gets removed, since the crit+5% is so potent, and with access to akamochi/pizza and +20 acc on the amano itself, it's relatively easy to cap acc. The loss of 12att/6STR is meh when tping if it gets you the extra 4 haste in the hand slot.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:19 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2018 1:10 pm
Posts: 556
Kubisnaxx wrote:
5/5 stp merits, rajas ring, brutal earring, +1 hachi hands


WS in hachi hands +1 for YGK, switch to alky for Kaiten


+1 Hachi hands rather difficult to come by atm...


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:25 pm 
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Joined: Mon Apr 11, 2016 12:53 am
Posts: 78
Kubisnaxx wrote:
5/5 stp merits, rajas ring, brutal earring, +1 hachi hands


WS in hachi hands +1 for YGK, switch to alky for Kaiten


That's what I do use. 3-4 potential issues

1. Dusk +1 is wasted.
2. I believe you need hachi feet or enkidu subligar in WS setup to make this work, which are both tough to find/unobtainable
3. hachi kote +1 is largely unobtainable now. Haven't seen a pair for sale in probably a year. and ENM is dead atm
4. A lot of people have reported better kaiten with bando/okote since you don't have the att buff like Gekko


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2022 9:53 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2022 8:06 pm
Posts: 1
good on you Ive been that guy

No matter what, if you want a polespear to have punching power its going to need weight behind it, but that also slows it down. Un fortunately, there becomes a point where its give and take.

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