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 Post subject: Re: Curious Grouping?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:19 am 
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Joined: Sun Jun 17, 2018 11:24 pm
Posts: 767
Reyes wrote:
To all of you posing to level two characters at once -- when I made my account I had to read rules and it states:

"Controlling two characters at once through any means at all is prohibited."

Doesn't that mean what everyone here is proposing is against rules for this server, or am I misunderstanding?

The rule is poorly written. It means using programs that can send commands to two characters at once simultaneously or similar. If you are manually controlling both characters you're fine.

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 Post subject: Re: Curious Grouping?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:08 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 09, 2020 11:51 pm
Posts: 6
Ahh, thank you! This helps me alot!


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 Post subject: Re: Curious Grouping?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 12, 2020 10:05 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 23, 2018 6:38 pm
Posts: 82
The majority of the server takes this as you cannot press 1 button and have both characters move forward at the same time... or voke at the same time etc. There are clearly people dual boxing everyday everywhere and nasomi seems fine with it so most consider this to be the correct interpretation of the rules. There's another thread talking about this recently you can go read it shouldn't be too hard to find.


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 Post subject: Re: Curious Grouping?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 12, 2020 10:26 pm 
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Posts: 356
cthalupa wrote:
If you are manually controlling both characters you're fine.


That's not quite true. The rule forbids simultaneous actions from characters even if it's done manually via two hands on separate keyboards or pressing a macro with a /wait 1 and then alt tabing and hitting a macro with no wait a second later.

I think the logic here is that Nasomi can't tell the difference between a legit and non-legit way of self-synced actions, so they're just banned in general.


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 Post subject: Re: Curious Grouping?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 12:59 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2017 10:12 pm
Posts: 753
The functionality of the included ashita has been changed since that rule was written. No doubt it still applies but it isn't a "you can never 2 box" rule. There were ways to do some things on the early server, that this rule applied to. It doesn't mention those things, for the same reason I'm not going to mention those things, which is because the first thing people will do is say "oh neat, I wonder if it will work", which some people probably do anyways. It's been clarified plenty of times that 2 boxing is fine and even expected on nasomi.

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 Post subject: Re: Curious Grouping?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 3:05 am 
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Posts: 767
Deadwing wrote:
cthalupa wrote:
If you are manually controlling both characters you're fine.


That's not quite true. The rule forbids simultaneous actions from characters even if it's done manually via two hands on separate keyboards or pressing a macro with a /wait 1 and then alt tabing and hitting a macro with no wait a second later.

I think the logic here is that Nasomi can't tell the difference between a legit and non-legit way of self-synced actions, so they're just banned in general.

I have all sorts of waits in macros on both characters that have nothing to do with making things synchronized and everything to do with needing the waits in the macros in general. I see actions go off in a synchronized manner dozens of times a day for my characters. With hundreds of players dual boxing at any given time, I imagine this occurs many thousands of times each day.

I don't see how what you're saying could be true.

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 Post subject: Re: Curious Grouping?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 3:27 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2016 9:37 am
Posts: 356
cthalupa wrote:
Deadwing wrote:
cthalupa wrote:
If you are manually controlling both characters you're fine.


That's not quite true. The rule forbids simultaneous actions from characters even if it's done manually via two hands on separate keyboards or pressing a macro with a /wait 1 and then alt tabing and hitting a macro with no wait a second later.

I think the logic here is that Nasomi can't tell the difference between a legit and non-legit way of self-synced actions, so they're just banned in general.

I have all sorts of waits in macros on both characters that have nothing to do with making things synchronized and everything to do with needing the waits in the macros in general. I see actions go off in a synchronized manner dozens of times a day for my characters. With hundreds of players dual boxing at any given time, I imagine this occurs many thousands of times each day.

I don't see how what you're saying could be true.


By the strictest letter of the law, it is true. In practice no one is going to care in the situation you're describing. On the other hand I recall two identical smns following each other, summoning two carbuncles at the same time, using bloodpacts at the same time, etc. They don't play here anymore. "it's one keyboard with two usb ports, no 3rd party programs bro" would not have worked as a defense in their case.


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 Post subject: Re: Curious Grouping?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 3:56 am 
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Joined: Sun Jun 17, 2018 11:24 pm
Posts: 767
Deadwing wrote:
cthalupa wrote:
Deadwing wrote:

That's not quite true. The rule forbids simultaneous actions from characters even if it's done manually via two hands on separate keyboards or pressing a macro with a /wait 1 and then alt tabing and hitting a macro with no wait a second later.

I think the logic here is that Nasomi can't tell the difference between a legit and non-legit way of self-synced actions, so they're just banned in general.

I have all sorts of waits in macros on both characters that have nothing to do with making things synchronized and everything to do with needing the waits in the macros in general. I see actions go off in a synchronized manner dozens of times a day for my characters. With hundreds of players dual boxing at any given time, I imagine this occurs many thousands of times each day.

I don't see how what you're saying could be true.


By the strictest letter of the law, it is true. In practice no one is going to care in the situation you're describing. On the other hand I recall two identical smns following each other, summoning two carbuncles at the same time, using bloodpacts at the same time, etc. They don't play here anymore. "it's one keyboard with two usb ports, no 3rd party programs bro" would not have worked as a defense in their case.

Sending multiple inputs using hardware is quite obviously the same sort of thing as sending multiple inputs with software.

That's a lot different than having macros with waits in them, which you specifically called out.

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 Post subject: Re: Curious Grouping?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 6:09 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2016 9:37 am
Posts: 356
They're all capable of sending commands out simultaneously, and are all prohibited by the current letter of the law.

In practice I don't think it would matter unless you were syncing casting for some sort of material benefit, such as one-shotting dynamis statues.


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 Post subject: Re: Curious Grouping?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 7:09 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 10, 2018 6:01 pm
Posts: 798
I talked to Nabutso about this rule when I was a newb. He said that it is worded poorly and that it should not be read as forbidding dual-keyboarding dualbox setups with two physical computers. Of course Nab isn't Nas, so here we are, waiting for stories.


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