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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 1:16 am 
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Nadrojj wrote:
I ask the question again though since it's still unanswered.

Why? Why did he focus on making changes to Ranger when there are so many other bugs in the game that should be addressed first?

Also should we expect the issues we're currently seeing with ranged weapon skills, zone lag and fishing freezing to persist through the weekend? It will drastically alter my plans if so.


The RNG change was a reaction to a "fix", see:

viewtopic.php?p=51203#p51203


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 1:19 am 
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Location: Québec
Nadrojj wrote:
I ask the question again though since it's still unanswered.

Why? Why did he focus on making changes to Ranger when there are so many other bugs in the game that should be addressed first?


It sometimes happens (see that amazing thread about the guy pretending to be jailed wrongfully), but more often than not Nasomi is not going to answer player questions here and does not participate on the forums outside of posting events and updates.

Nabutso can share what he knows about a situation, but he is not an admin nor a speaker for Nasomi and the information is provided to the best of his knowledge only.

You should probably make fun plans for the week-end and pass by occasionally to see if the server's condition has improved. =S

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Last edited by Piellar on Sat Mar 02, 2019 1:23 am, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 1:22 am 
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Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2018 4:04 pm
Posts: 25
Any Particular reason cities are perma R2000?

Can we get a roll back to thursday, thanks.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 1:23 am 
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Posts: 88
Jessikitty wrote:
Anyone notice any TP changes with the patch?

Yesterday, with 34 Store TP (Traits, Merits, Gear), 420 delay GK. I was getting 143 TP per swing. Now I'm getting 134 per swing post patch.

Level 1 job with a 218 delay Sword. Should be getting 59 TP per swing. Getting 51 per swing post patch.

Edit:

So I've fiddled around with stuff and the TP returns I'm getting today are the same values I'd get if I used a weapon with 30 less delay.

30 Delay is about half a second in real world time which is inline with the change Nasomi made.

Is this intended? If so, this has a big ripple effect on gear choices and merits compared to retail.


Any plans to address this?

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 1:28 am 
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Posts: 286
I now I see no reason DNC/SCH won't be released ;p
Never going to happen means yes it will.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 1:30 am 
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Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2018 2:51 am
Posts: 215
Nabutso wrote:
Avellion wrote:
Nabutso wrote:
What is 'everything else'?

It's a buff to the high end and a nerf to the low end. Retail was a nerf to everything but the high end, which didn't get buffed.

Go try it out for yourself instead of freaking out. No one here has actually went and seen what the damage and accuracy differences are yet.


Mind if I ask what the reasoning behind the change was? Perhaps if we got a glimpse of Nasomi's reasoning, it may alleviate some people's worry. Right now it seems like a change for the sake of a change. Was RNG, the way it was before this, not acceptable?

Just trying to wrap my head around it.

A bug with weapon delay was discovered that, when fixed, would allow for RNGs to build insane amounts of TP at close range. This is mostly to deter you from meleeing while ranging. But nothing is stopping you from doing so - you still build TP faster while meleeing, and it could still be worth it because of that. People just need to -actually try it out-.

That's the reasoning that I've heard from nas as far as I understand it.

Quote:
It is a huge nerf.

Even ignoring WS being broken, OWNMs are now shitty as a Ranger - racc seems to be heavily reduced outside of the sweet spot as well. Any kite fight is going to have the same issue.

It's a major nerf for merit/xp parties, as previously mentioned.

There is nothing positive about this for rangers. Doing a bit more damage at some point where you were barely ever be is not balance.

So you've killed some OWNMs, done merit/exp parties, etc, within the past hour since the maint came out?



Is it too late to point out that a half a second delay that wasn't intended being peeled away is in no way shape or form going to drastically effect the time it takes ranger to get 1000 TP relative to other jobs when that same change is applied to every job? The rate at which ranger out TPs everything short of a Samurai would remain the same as it was before. If it wasn't broken before the change, why would it then be broken after the change?

Beastmaster being able to charm mobs and bump their levels to 85 was obviously broken. A change that was necessary. Summoner dropping 3K Predator Claws on mobs that were level 99 was also obviously broken and in need of repair.

Giving ranger an arrow to the knee because of broken delay calculations doesn't make sense - and I don't play the job, nor have any vested interest in keeping it "overpowered." I just remember the great ranger exodus of 06, and really don't want to see the same mistake made here.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 1:38 am 
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Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2019 7:56 am
Posts: 10
Piellar wrote:
Nadrojj wrote:
I ask the question again though since it's still unanswered.

Why? Why did he focus on making changes to Ranger when there are so many other bugs in the game that should be addressed first?


It sometimes happens (see that amazing thread about the guy pretending to be jailed wrongfully), but more often than not Nasomi is not going to answer player questions here and does not participate on the forums outside of posting events and updates.

Nabutso can share what he knows about a situation, but he is not an admin nor a speaker for Nasomi and the information is provided to the best of his knowledge only.

You should probably make fun plans for the week-end and pass by occasionally to see if the server's condition has improved. =S


Ohhh, where is that thread?


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 1:49 am 
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Joined: Sat May 26, 2018 1:24 am
Posts: 242
Location: Québec
musufasa wrote:
Piellar wrote:
Nadrojj wrote:
I ask the question again though since it's still unanswered.

Why? Why did he focus on making changes to Ranger when there are so many other bugs in the game that should be addressed first?


It sometimes happens (see that amazing thread about the guy pretending to be jailed wrongfully), but more often than not Nasomi is not going to answer player questions here and does not participate on the forums outside of posting events and updates.

Nabutso can share what he knows about a situation, but he is not an admin nor a speaker for Nasomi and the information is provided to the best of his knowledge only.

You should probably make fun plans for the week-end and pass by occasionally to see if the server's condition has improved. =S


Ohhh, where is that thread?


This is it : viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8412

A fun read.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 1:58 am 
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Posts: 383
Aewyn wrote:
Nabutso wrote:
Avellion wrote:

Mind if I ask what the reasoning behind the change was? Perhaps if we got a glimpse of Nasomi's reasoning, it may alleviate some people's worry. Right now it seems like a change for the sake of a change. Was RNG, the way it was before this, not acceptable?

Just trying to wrap my head around it.

A bug with weapon delay was discovered that, when fixed, would allow for RNGs to build insane amounts of TP at close range. This is mostly to deter you from meleeing while ranging. But nothing is stopping you from doing so - you still build TP faster while meleeing, and it could still be worth it because of that. People just need to -actually try it out-.

That's the reasoning that I've heard from nas as far as I understand it.

Quote:
It is a huge nerf.

Even ignoring WS being broken, OWNMs are now shitty as a Ranger - racc seems to be heavily reduced outside of the sweet spot as well. Any kite fight is going to have the same issue.

It's a major nerf for merit/xp parties, as previously mentioned.

There is nothing positive about this for rangers. Doing a bit more damage at some point where you were barely ever be is not balance.

So you've killed some OWNMs, done merit/exp parties, etc, within the past hour since the maint came out?



Is it too late to point out that a half a second delay that wasn't intended being peeled away is in no way shape or form going to drastically effect the time it takes ranger to get 1000 TP relative to other jobs when that same change is applied to every job? The rate at which ranger out TPs everything short of a Samurai would remain the same as it was before. If it wasn't broken before the change, why would it then be broken after the change?

Beastmaster being able to charm mobs and bump their levels to 85 was obviously broken. A change that was necessary. Summoner dropping 3K Predator Claws on mobs that were level 99 was also obviously broken and in need of repair.

Giving ranger an arrow to the knee because of broken delay calculations doesn't make sense - and I don't play the job, nor have any vested interest in keeping it "overpowered." I just remember the great ranger exodus of 06, and really don't want to see the same mistake made here.


I know you're not defending the patch, but what's funny to me is that there were people who thought Rng built TP faster than any melee jobs on this server prior to this update, when it couldn't have been further from the truth. Given a haste or marches, any reasonably geared two-hander melee class should out TP any Rng with the same level of gear at close to two times the rate provided they both have the same hit rate. I've said it before in another thread but any Ranger who relies on melee attack rounds to get TP was hindering their own damage output.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 2:06 am 
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Joined: Fri May 25, 2018 5:05 pm
Posts: 58
Tex wrote:
Aewyn wrote:
Nabutso wrote:
A bug with weapon delay was discovered that, when fixed, would allow for RNGs to build insane amounts of TP at close range. This is mostly to deter you from meleeing while ranging. But nothing is stopping you from doing so - you still build TP faster while meleeing, and it could still be worth it because of that. People just need to -actually try it out-.

That's the reasoning that I've heard from nas as far as I understand it.


So you've killed some OWNMs, done merit/exp parties, etc, within the past hour since the maint came out?



Is it too late to point out that a half a second delay that wasn't intended being peeled away is in no way shape or form going to drastically effect the time it takes ranger to get 1000 TP relative to other jobs when that same change is applied to every job? The rate at which ranger out TPs everything short of a Samurai would remain the same as it was before. If it wasn't broken before the change, why would it then be broken after the change?

Beastmaster being able to charm mobs and bump their levels to 85 was obviously broken. A change that was necessary. Summoner dropping 3K Predator Claws on mobs that were level 99 was also obviously broken and in need of repair.

Giving ranger an arrow to the knee because of broken delay calculations doesn't make sense - and I don't play the job, nor have any vested interest in keeping it "overpowered." I just remember the great ranger exodus of 06, and really don't want to see the same mistake made here.


I know you're not defending the patch, but what's funny to me is that there were people who thought Rng built TP faster than any melee jobs on this server prior to this update, when it couldn't have been further from the truth. Given a haste or marches, any reasonably geared two-hander melee class should out TP any Rng with the same level of gear at close to two times the rate provided they both have the same hit rate. I've said it before in another thread but any Ranger who relies on melee attack rounds to get TP was hindering their own damage output.


This. I was in an EXP PT last night with a DRG who gained TP just as fast, sometimes faster than I was... (Pending barrage/jump timers)

In Exp my melee attacks only happened on 1 of 2 occasions. 1) Cooldown ended before i hit my R.A. Macro, which only occurred once or twice a fight. 2) I pulled hate early in a fight so I stopped using my RAs to let the tank get hate back.

I really don't have a huge problem with this melee nerf if it worked as Nabutso said should be intended (Im imagining 80-90% not in sweet spot, 110-120% in sweet spot) However It does ruin some of the fun of RNG to me. Plus the broken WS ruined my weekend so I am a little bitter.

I vote velocity shot as reparations!


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