There's nothing to git gud at when it auto-claims and you have 30-60 seconds of input delay or more though, you can't just fight through lag when its that bad, is not a matter of effort.

Don't get rid of the HNMs, just also offer force pops until the lag issues get fixed to the point where we don't see a full minute of input delay and repeated zone crashes. Its not fun, its not challenging, its just tedious and frustrating to lose claim because of lag or intentional disruption from other shells. Having the option to use force pops will remove some players form HNM zones and doesn't require a lot of effort or constant babytsitting from Nasomi, like having to check logs every Fafnir pop after someone claims there was foul play involved. If the NQ pop items come from KS99 or something like that and drop rates are appropriate they're not going to devalue the gear.

Unless we get some serious ban action happening and/or a strictly-enforced global rule limiting the number of players in the zone when another shell claims this isn't going to get any better. There's little accountability for zone crashes and intentionally lagging other shells out, people are just going to keep doing it and feigning ignorance when called on it. Having the option to use force pops is the simplest solution and won't change anything about the "spirit of the game" since the HNMs will still be there for anyone who wants to camp them.

ppl don't camp HNM because they enjoy wasting 3 hours, they do it for the drama and competition when you pack that many ppl in a zone for one thing.

lessening that is stupid. it's what is special. fix the lag, remove the OWNMs. ban retards.

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Standing around for 3 hours only to lose claim due to lag or other shells being dicks is stupid, its a waste of time. There's no competition when it auto-claims. I don't care how this gets fixed, but offering force pops alongside the HNMs seems like the simplest solution and one that won't make a consistent headache for Nasomi. And again, I'm not suggesting the HNMs be removed in favor of force pops, just offer them alongside the HNMs, the special-ness of camping HNMs would still be there.

I understand where some people are coming from when they say its not in the spirit of the game or whatever, but neither is auto-claiming HNMs or forcing flails/spamming to cause lag for that matter. I'm there for gear, not drama, and competition and banter is great when everyone is playing fairly and respectfully but that's not what happens most of the time. I'd love to see a global rule enforced that requires all but a holding party warp out on claims and to see Nasomi hand out bans to people who stand there and cast shit to cause lag or zone OWNMs but I don't think its realistic to expect him to police every pop or to thoroughly examine every accusation of foul play, he's just one guy and has a lot to deal with already. Offer force pops, anyone who doesn't want to deal with the BS at the actual camps doesn't have to go and anyone who does still can until the lag issues are dealt with.

The TL;DR for this entire thread's worth of sensible posts.

that's incorrect. Making it so the best LS's on the server have no reason to be at spawns means the "special-ness" of camping HNMs would no longer be there.

That's our point.


less time creating events where we kill bulls with giant katanas... more time making it so I can't crash any zone I feel like.

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Just here to gently remind you that there are people who have spent hundreds of hours at these camps at this point and the ones in favor of the force pop idea are just that much more irked by that you have such an opinion about it and you aren't a frequent or even really regular attender of these hnm camps. I'm neutral here. I do not care. I put in my time at these camps and I've gotten just about all I want from them and will continue to put time into them for my team. It won't make me happy nor bother me if another route to these items were created. I just wanna remind you of the gripe people are going to have with you over having such a strong opinion of this.

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Just here to gently remind you that those people can have their opinions too. An appeal to authority is a fun logical fallacy, but still one nonetheless.

I solve the issue that everyone else says is unbearable and removing the fun of the game (the lag) by not attending camps very often until it's fixed, instead of ramming my head into a man-made wall and asking for a poor solution to be implemented to fix it.

Edit: Either way, good looking out. People not liking me because of forum posts isn't lost on me. Thanks Aeroo, lol. i do <3 u. Plenty of people that justify the time of spending hours a day in an unplayable zone also agree with me that the way to fix it isn't by pop spawns. Sapa comes to mind.

Force pops are the lazy solution for Nasomi. If he does them, great. It's his server. That doesn't mean folks that agree with that shouldn't point it out. He has a massive lag problem, and instead of fixing it.. He makes the game easier and less competitive. Great job. Like I said, it's his server, but that doesn't mean I'm going to sign a petition for him to take the lazy way out.

I'm also not sure what your post is responding to in the quoted post you have, if that's something about that one. I merely told Scaggles that removing the best LS's from HNMs camps does impact the HNM camps, and that I'd prefer him to fix the stability of the game rather than development time of the one developer be spent on events. I don't think either of those is very inflammatory.

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Lag is bad

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this was funnier before everyone copied me

Again, I dont really care either way. I just want something to be done. Everyone can agree that the lag is the main issue and needs to be resolved. If it cant be resolved within a reasonable timetable (I personally think its past due already) then a tactical solution needs to be implemented. Having new people see this thread or outsiders watching the shit show that ensues at every HQ via twitch doesnt look good for the server and is a very poor player experience for nearly everyone.

To be perfectly frank, I don't really care about the "special-ness" of camping HNMs. Its a complete and utter shit-show every time there's a HQ pop, people want the drops, they're not there for the thrill of camping it. As Aeroo pointed out, people have spent hundreds of hours at these camps, there's nothing special about it to many players, the novelty you speak of has long since worn off. I'm not trying to insult you, I have no problem with you at all, we're just having a discussion here and its been pretty civil, but you really haven't spent much time at these camps from what I can tell, and to be fair I haven't been going for a while either because its just a horrible experience every time and I hate going. Again, I'm not trying to insult anyone or say anyone is not entitled to their opinion or to express it, regardless of how long they've been playing here. But auto-claiming HNM is absolutely not in the spirit of the game either, there's no thrill of competition when it spawns claimed to a "random" player so the "not in the spirit of the game" excuse seems rather arbitrary to me.


This. It looks bad for the server and most importantly its not enjoyable for anyone involved. If the lag isn't going to go away and we won't see any kind of fix for a while, we need bans to be handed out, we need strict enforcement because its just ridiculous as it is.



If another LS claims Nidhogg, heck off and warp out. Leave a single holding party in case they wipe, but the LS with claim is entitled to a fair shot at killing it without interference. If what Vik says is accurate then force pops cannot exist alongside the regular HNM, we need some new rules and strict enforcement instead. I'm tired of seeing/hearing about Nidhoggs lost because other players crash the zone and intentionally cause lag, this shit needs to stop. Someone was jailed for forcing a flail or whatever a few months ago, players need to start getting jailed for this shit as well because the intent and result is the same, the LS with claim losing the mob due to outside interference. If you're 75 and camping Fafnir/Niddhog, you know what you're doing, you cannot feign ignorance when you spam bar spells or cures or zone the OWNM. Nidhogg shouldn't be passed around to every LS present by means of intentionally causing lag or crashing the zone to make the shell with claim lose the mob.

I'm all for healthy competition at HNM camps but when the result of that competition is not respected there's no point in having it.