Big difference is DDs take risk while fighting, smn doesn't.

This nerf isn't even that bad, smn still does improper damage on 99 mobs so eh.

But 2h dd are 2h dd and smn is smn. Smn also is 100% safer damage, BP generate no tp, you have aoe buffs like hastega among countless other things summoner can do that a heavy dd cannot. Each job does different things and we can't compare a backline support role with 2handed dd that just do damage.

idk. so many things are broken. I've spent 150k on one dynamis run from being auto homepointed, and lost the lot on all my jobs gears too. I've died at 100% hp to so many hell dives stompings bomb tosses astral flows and mijin gakures. I just want to have some fun when i log on you know. i didnt feel like my summoner was owning everything in sight. I haven't heard of any summoner related exploits to end game fights. It was just fun to drop 1800 on dynamis trash every 60 seconds thats all. Why are removing fun from the server? What are the imbalance issues? What was the smn exploit that was trivializing everything because i never saw or heard of it.

what i did hear tho is that nabutso is againt summoner burns and has been lobbying nas to nerf summoner for a while.

_________________

My comment is directly speaking to the person I quoted - he was impressed with that damage like it was a large number, and it's really not. Any 2H DD crushes that damage number, and the disparity grows with levels.

I'm just saying that amount of damage is very small in the grand scheme of things. Just because it's a big number doesn't mean it's a lot of damage (speaking to Shiva, as his comment was). The actual problem emerges on endgame content, where the damage is high AND hate free / risk free. I mean I saw Garuda pulling hate and face tanking Tiamat, it needed adjustment for sure.

Like others have said however, that doesn't solve the problem. It just takes longer now to do the same thing. So then was it a problem to begin with? Perhaps, but not the root. Ultimately, if completing content with Summoner is a "problem" - the only fix is to nerf their damage into the ground.

If Summoner damage was in fact nerfed significantly, they'd be used for 1% of content in the game. Everyone talks about "in era" here and in the BST thread, for instance, but that game sucked for many jobs in era, and QOL or tweaks to make stuff competitive is welcome. On a side note, when was the 2H buff again? Late 2007, end of TOAU or so? I can't remember.

If Double Slap damage, for example, had got significantly nerfed - do you think anyone on Nasomi is going to bring Summoner instead of, or with, a Red Mage? Hell no, they'll bring another SAM (or any 2H dd) who spams 800+ damage pentas every 15-20 seconds on Bats + everything flying mob in every camp thereafter. It would be a worse BLM (who has amazing utility + amazing damage, even if the utility is mitigated endgame) who actually did never get parties, because nobody would want it at 75.

Summoner can do a lot of stuff, surely - but how impactful is any of that at endgame? Beyond maybe some really quirky uses for specific Blood Pacts (that aren't even needed) - if Summoners didn't do damage - would people actually want or bring them? The answer is no. Then the job becomes what it -actually- was in retail - a shittier WHM. Every DD can sub NIN, so there's never an XP situation you want 2 healers anyway. So instead of the job being complete dogshit, it does good damage. It's not like Garuda is equpping KCs and zerging AV (or anything) in 25 seconds.

So tl;dr - Summoner damage was definitely too high, but that is not the core problem, because they're still capable of the same thing. Maybe enrage timer on Kings is tighter now or something as a result, idk. The damage being lowered is 100% okay - and it is also okay for Summoner to compete for a DD slot. If the damage was appropriate for level 99 mobs only, it would be a non issue - but Summoner 1-69 is getting hit as a result, which is not the problem.

My comment is telling the person that Double Slap damage is a big number, but it isn't a ton of damage in the grand scheme of things. It has nothing to do with whatever mania you've come up with on your own.

What you heard is wrong. You must not have been playing at the time, but a particular single SMN BP was doing fully unresisted damage on all targets, including lv 99 mobs people EXP'd on. The BP was programmed to never resist because whoever wrote it many years ago forgot to put it's damage through the proper functions. That BP was brought to my attention and people argued to me that it was not an exploit to use that BP to obtain absurd amounts of EXP from lv 99 mobs at very low levels. Nas addressed the exploit and now SMNs have their magic BPs all at least having a chance to resist, as they should.

I pushed nas to make sure the exploit was fixed as people were using it more and more. I have never and will never tell people not to do "SMN burns" and I'm sick and tired of people accusing me of being against "SMN burns", nor have I ever told anyone not to do a "SMN burn" nor does nas think people shouldn't be able to do a "SMN burn".

I understand you have some sort of grudge against me now because I asked you not to PM nas about an issue that you shouldn't PM nas about, but you really should take the things people tell you in stride instead of assume they are trying to be mean to you. It's infinitely faster for a player to get advice about a quest, mission, or almost anything really, than it is to PM nas - especially when he will actively ignore it if it's not something he's supposed to deal with.

_________________
Returning/Existing Player? Trouble logging in? Click here |~| New player Gil guide |~| More Troubleshooting

It's wild that people blame two different people for ruining smn burns.

#mybad

ppl still do it anyways, just has to wait for lvl 65. Oh well.

_________________

No worries OP, every job and game mechanic will stand in front of the nerf bat at some point, during the process of replacing the crappier parts of Dark Star code left in the server. The game will become a little harder every time but also more faithful to the original material, and that much more fun because what you'll manage to achieve will mean something.

I think only PUP will become easier to play through that process.

_________________
Baleful Badger

Haha - I was talking about the meteorite nerf

_________________

o