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 Post subject: Re: Parser
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2019 8:17 am 
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Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2018 4:39 pm
Posts: 596
It would be nice to have if it was personal only, only tracking your own figures. Then you'd be able to test things and do accurate comparisons.

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 Post subject: Re: Parser
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2019 8:38 am 
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Posts: 119
Viktoriya wrote:
Most people wouldn't use it responsibly and would use it for the wrong reasons. Like recount in WoW for example, incredibly useful tool to tweak gems and diff specs for very specific niche things on certain fights. Instead, so many people are fuckin retarded with it and herp a derp. This stuff can actually lead to worse game play over all when people start doing scumbag dps.

What is scumbag dps? It's when dps don't switch targets and pad numbers with aoe damage in WoW.
Scumbag dps is when people jump to a new exp mob at like 10% so they never have delay with putting weapons away. I've kicked people in retail for doing stuff like that because it leads to either the brd getting whacked on and makes things messy.


hahah yeah i had a drk doing that , the mob got hit and run to the brd that was far away pulling another mob.....tank had to run to voke it , making the 1 mob follow him , and we all wasted time , it happened x3 until the leader got mad , u arent helping at all, stop or get kicked :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Parser
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2019 8:46 am 
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Posts: 85
I think it's important to remember that without the damage formulas DSP never could have existed in any remotely correct form, thus no Nasomi server. Damage formulas that were obtained largely through research done by the player base using parsers. Having them available for testing is very important for finding errors in the way certain things are coded. Also somewhat important is they were openly used and discussed in retail without fear of punishment. I don't recall any toxic experiences due to parsing in my time on retail. It was largely used to add a fun competition aspect to otherwise boring repetitive meriting, and to test things.

People are going to give bad players a hard time regardless if they show up to a party with terrible gear or play terrible in general, you don't need a parser for that.

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 Post subject: Re: Parser
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2019 9:40 am 
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Joined: Sat Jul 22, 2017 6:39 pm
Posts: 126
Arx wrote:
I think it's important to remember that without the damage formulas DSP never could have existed in any remotely correct form, thus no Nasomi server. Damage formulas that were obtained largely through research done by the player base using parsers. Having them available for testing is very important for finding errors in the way certain things are coded. Also somewhat important is they were openly used and discussed in retail without fear of punishment. I don't recall any toxic experiences due to parsing in my time on retail. It was largely used to add a fun competition aspect to otherwise boring repetitive meriting, and to test things.

People are going to give bad players a hard time regardless if they show up to a party with terrible gear or play terrible in general, you don't need a parser for that.


There’s no perfect solution here. Endgame players would want to test real shit, like the MACC change tomorrow (guess today) he mentioned, but the 1400 other souls would use it to bully/kick people. The bully/kick drama is what Nasomi would have to deal with.

The only thing I can think of would be opening Parse’s in specific zones (I.E Dragon’s Aery, Behemoths Dominion, Valley of Sorrows, Mount Z, KRT, Sea Zones, Sky Zones Dyna, etc.). Mount Z and KRT are already the top exp zones so those would be overly EXPed on if a Parse for the zones were available.

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 Post subject: Re: Parser
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2019 10:54 am 
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Posts: 1465
I'm not really against parsers, fuckboys gonna fuckboy. I feel there will be self-correction in instances such as Vik's where those types of people will be kicked/not invited in the first place. I would've never been able to truly test my damage numbers as MNK on retail with Fuma's vs Dune Boots without a parser so I see no reason why we shouldn't be allowed to access one here without feeling like we could get in trouble.

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 Post subject: Re: Parser
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2019 12:18 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 2:35 pm
Posts: 2629
ChaseandFreeze wrote:
Tex wrote:
exelyon wrote:
Bullying is part of it, but another part is keeping people from establishing extremely firm metas with data. He doesnt want the forums covered in proof that thfs are 66% as effective as a drk who is 66% effect as a sam. Trash jobs are obviously still going to get left out, a lot, but it wont be proven on every other thread by parses.


I think the main benefit from them to me would be being able to easily produce a large enough sample size of tests/data to help find bugs or inaccuracies that can be fixed and ultimately improve the server. To me this is worth the trade off in maybe a slight increase in toxicity that will already exist anyway, but tbh I can't imagine it actually changing anything much on that front. I can see your argument though.


I get your thought process behind this, but the majority of this would be used in EXP parties, which would create toxicity. People who do endgame know what brings the most DMG to events, hence what jobs endgamers recruit, if that makes sense.I'd love for a meripo parse, sure? But then again, you know when you see the gear.


Well yeah, lol, but because of parsers. I don’t understand what we gain from these threads when everyone collectively pretends that no one uses them because they’re against the rules. I don’t use it because I genuinely can’t figure out how to... or I would. It’s a dumb rule that isn’t actually stopping anyone. It’s just stopping anyone from using them to help Nas, which is a really weird outcome.

Every LS after events has some random dude that posts parsers.

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 Post subject: Re: Parser
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2019 12:31 pm 
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Posts: 596
Wolffhardt wrote:
Every LS after events has some random dude that posts parsers.


There's usually a dedicated person who adds up all the figures from the combat log. It's a rough job, but someone has to do it.

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 Post subject: Re: Parser
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2019 12:52 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 2:35 pm
Posts: 2629
Miku wrote:
Wolffhardt wrote:
Every LS after events has some random dude that posts parsers.


There's usually a dedicated person who adds up all the figures from the combat log. It's a rough job, but someone has to do it.


:lol:

Glad you guys found something for Sapa to do

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...TopShelf told Nas to roll back all your ZNM gear, do the gilpocalypse and nerf Fishing/RNG into the ground.


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 Post subject: Re: Parser
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2019 1:38 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2016 1:07 am
Posts: 59
Wolffhardt wrote:
ChaseandFreeze wrote:
Tex wrote:

I think the main benefit from them to me would be being able to easily produce a large enough sample size of tests/data to help find bugs or inaccuracies that can be fixed and ultimately improve the server. To me this is worth the trade off in maybe a slight increase in toxicity that will already exist anyway, but tbh I can't imagine it actually changing anything much on that front. I can see your argument though.


I get your thought process behind this, but the majority of this would be used in EXP parties, which would create toxicity. People who do endgame know what brings the most DMG to events, hence what jobs endgamers recruit, if that makes sense.I'd love for a meripo parse, sure? But then again, you know when you see the gear.


Well yeah, lol, but because of parsers. I don’t understand what we gain from these threads when everyone collectively pretends that no one uses them because they’re against the rules. I don’t use it because I genuinely can’t figure out how to... or I would. It’s a dumb rule that isn’t actually stopping anyone. It’s just stopping anyone from using them to help Nas, which is a really weird outcome.

Every LS after events has some random dude that posts parsers.



Sorry, didn’t realize this was the current practice. My next rebuttal would be that if there are people in the community that are already doing it by hand, then what’s the harm in giving them a tool to expedite the process? To me, the argument that it would increase bullying is a weak one because it’s very unlikely someone would get hazed from being at the bottom of the parse if the party is going well. I see the argument that Viktoryia states about people trying to maximize their parse by not finishing mobs, but it’s not reason enough to make it an illegal adddon, in my view.

In other words, the benefits to the server far outweigh the consequences, and I feel the truth of the matter is that Nas doesn’t want data available that’s checking his work.


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 Post subject: Re: Parser
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2019 1:48 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 2:35 pm
Posts: 2629
Zadok wrote:
Wolffhardt wrote:
ChaseandFreeze wrote:

I get your thought process behind this, but the majority of this would be used in EXP parties, which would create toxicity. People who do endgame know what brings the most DMG to events, hence what jobs endgamers recruit, if that makes sense.I'd love for a meripo parse, sure? But then again, you know when you see the gear.


Well yeah, lol, but because of parsers. I don’t understand what we gain from these threads when everyone collectively pretends that no one uses them because they’re against the rules. I don’t use it because I genuinely can’t figure out how to... or I would. It’s a dumb rule that isn’t actually stopping anyone. It’s just stopping anyone from using them to help Nas, which is a really weird outcome.

Every LS after events has some random dude that posts parsers.



Sorry, didn’t realize this was the current practice. My next rebuttal would be that if there are people in the community that are already doing it by hand, then what’s the harm in giving them a tool to expedite the process? To me, the argument that it would increase bullying is a weak one because it’s very unlikely someone would get hazed from being at the bottom of the parse if the party is going well. I see the argument that Viktoryia states about people trying to maximize their parse by not finishing mobs, but it’s not reason enough to make it an illegal adddon, in my view.

In other words, the benefits to the server far outweigh the consequences, and I feel the truth of the matter is that Nas doesn’t want data available that’s checking his work.



Lol that was the joke. Plenty of people are just using the parsers that aren't allowed. No one is doing it by hand.

I don't need a parser to tell me someone in terrible gear is holding the party back, if that's what I'm worried about.

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...TopShelf told Nas to roll back all your ZNM gear, do the gilpocalypse and nerf Fishing/RNG into the ground.


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